Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 7997;andrew.cmu.edu;Ted Anderson Received: from unix9.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for +dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr11/tm2b/space/space.dl@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr11/tm2b/space/space.dl) (->ota+space.digests) ID ; Fri, 31 May 91 14:18:27 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: Precedence: junk Reply-To: space+@Andrew.CMU.EDU From: space-request+@Andrew.CMU.EDU To: space+@Andrew.CMU.EDU Date: Fri, 31 May 91 14:18:02 -0400 (EDT) Subject: SPACE Digest V13 #581 SPACE Digest Volume 13 : Issue 581 Today's Topics: Re: SPACE STATION FREEDOM WOUNDED Fred cut, AXAF and SIRTF funded Re: Space Station Cancelled Fred vs. Exploration and Science Re: Progress? (was: Re: Ethics of Terraforming) STUDENT GROUPS USF,INC. UPDATE 8 United Space Federation, Inc. Update 8 Administrivia: Submissions to the SPACE Digest/sci.space should be mailed to space+@andrew.cmu.edu. Other mail, esp. [un]subscription requests, should be sent to space-request+@andrew.cmu.edu, or, if urgent, to tm2b+@andrew.cmu.edu ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 17 May 91 03:58:08 GMT From: ogicse!sequent!muncher.sequent.com!szabo@decwrl.dec.com Subject: Re: SPACE STATION FREEDOM WOUNDED In article <29175@hydra.gatech.EDU> ccoprmd@prism.gatech.EDU (Matthew DeLuca) writes: >If the two exerpted lines above aren't the biggest load of sh*t I've seen >in months, I don't know what is. > >We have more asteroid chunks on earth than we know what to do with... > we'veanalyzed hundreds and hundreds of them over the years, Talk about a load of sh*t. The funding for asteroid sample analysis has been less than 1/10 of 1% -- one-one-thousanth -- of what NASA has spent on the Shuttle and, if it were not for the hard work of intelligent explorers like James Van Allen and lobbyists like Jim Bowery, would waste on Fred. Due to the lack of care and attention on these issues by so-called space supporters like yourself, we remain woefully ignorant about basic questions regarding these resources. We have a tremendous amount still to be learned about these fragments. I notice you missed my list of outstanding problems of interest to future space development, so here they are again -- now this time sit down and _think_ about them, OK? Here are three biggies (there are many others as well): * The supply and distribtion of water in earth-crossing objects. * The frequency of, origin of, and earth-crossing asteroid(s) source of urelite diamonds. * The existence of nickel-iron regolith. A greatly expanded study of samples, and collection of new samples, along with the other suggested missions you deleted -- visual survey and infrared telescope probes -- can greatly illuminate or resolve these problems. -- Nick Szabo szabo@sequent.com "If you understand something the first time you see it, you probably knew it already. The more bewildered you are, the more successful the mission was." -- Ed Stone, Voyager space explorer ------------------------------ Date: 17 May 91 04:08:52 GMT From: ogicse!sequent!muncher.sequent.com!szabo@decwrl.dec.com Subject: Fred cut, AXAF and SIRTF funded In article dlbres10@pc.usl.edu (Fraering Philip) writes: >I don't think Freedom's a good idea, but let's face facts: >1. It will probably have its budget restored by the Senate. We need to work hard to prevent this. >2. Killing Freedom will not transfer its money to space science. That is _exactly_ what Congress did: it cut all funding for Fred, and gave full funding to SIRTF and AXAF. The Luddites have a real myth going here about poltical necessity of astronauts. Polls have always shown that citizens are every bit as enamoured with real exploration as they are with astronaut stunts. Now, Congress has demostrated that astronauts and their groupies are _not_ politically important to the space program. Space exploration no longer needs to be beholden to the centrally planned, wasteful projects that astronaut fans have forced on the program. This week, two major exploration efforts were funded because a collosal pork barrel was cut. A happy week indeed! -- Nick Szabo szabo@sequent.com "If you understand something the first time you see it, you probably knew it already. The more bewildered you are, the more successful the mission was." -- Ed Stone, Voyager space explorer ------------------------------ Date: 17 May 91 03:06:40 GMT From: swrinde!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!usc!jarthur!nntp-server.caltech.edu!palmer@ucsd.edu (David Palmer) Subject: Re: Space Station Cancelled henry@zoo.toronto.edu (Henry Spencer) writes: >Not to mention Galileo overruns. Anyone want to bet on the effects when >CRAF and Cassini run over? And EOS is enough to give one the shivers. Actually CRAF/Cassini is funded by an arrangement in which Cassini overruns get taken out of CRAF. Which is why they are often mentioned in the same breath. At least, that's the current plan. -- David Palmer palmer@gap.cco.caltech.edu ...rutgers!cit-vax!gap.cco.caltech.edu!palmer "Operator, get me the number for 911" --Homer Simpson ------------------------------ Date: 17 May 91 04:58:48 GMT From: ogicse!sequent!muncher.sequent.com!szabo@decwrl.dec.com Subject: Fred vs. Exploration and Science Excerpts from news wire post in sci.physics. Note my ^^^^^ emphasis. Not only has space exploration been victorious, but the important science-advancing efforts of NSF have been enhanced as well. The myth that astronauts are politically necessary for space funding has finally been put to rest. Subject: House Panels Vote To Kill 1992 Funds For Space Station Date: Thu, 16 May 91 10:45:08 -0400 (EDT) WASHINGTON -- House Appropriations subcommittees voted to kill fiscal 1992 funding for the space station and trim President Bush's request for the superconducting supercollider almost 19%. The more than $2 billion savings from the costly station would be ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ redistributed to help finance increases elsewhere in space programs and ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ the National Science Foundation, as well as an expanded $6.6 billion ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ budget for the Environmental Protection Agency. The National Science Foundation would receive an estimated $2.7 billion, including $1.96 billion for research activities or nearly 16% more than the current fiscal year ending Sept. 30. Within the $13.65 billion allocated to the National Aeronautics and Space Administration, lawmakers approved the administration's full requests for the ambitious Earth Observing System satellite program and AXAF X-ray telescope. ..... -- Nick Szabo szabo@sequent.com "If you understand something the first time you see it, you probably knew it already. The more bewildered you are, the more successful the mission was." -- Ed Stone, Voyager space explorer ------------------------------ Date: 17 May 91 01:08:56 GMT From: swrinde!cs.utexas.edu!sun-barr!ccut!wnoc-tyo-news!astemgw!kuis!rins!will@ucsd.edu (will) Subject: Re: Progress? (was: Re: Ethics of Terraforming) In article <1991May15.022130.2006@agate.berkeley.edu>, fcrary@lightning.Berkeley.EDU (Frank Crary) writes: >What is in the long term interests >of mankind in NOT the same as doing what will cause people the least >discomfort today. > Perhaps the Japanese can offer something here. Acually the Japanese are very good at thinking about their future. When Admiral Perry came to Japan over 100 years ago the Japanese at that time realized that it was best to think about the future than to fight America. They did'nt think about 5, 10, 50 years into the future. These quys where thinking in terms of generations and hundreds of years. And as a result of this thinking are now a World class economic power. Just to quote Mr. Morita of Sony: "U.S. managers are often criticized for their short-term outlook, supposedly forced on them by Wall Street". (Morita recalls a chat with a money trader in New York) "I enquired how far ahead he looks, One week?, "No, No" came the reply. "Ten minutes." was the answer. If Americans think only in terms of 10 minute action, while we Japanese think in 10-year terms, America assuredly faces gradual decline". Respectivly, if mankind (as a hole, not just America) does not change it way of thinking about the future, then all of the grand plans of inhabiting our solar system or what-ever will also face disaster. By the way, the Japanese are changing. I was surprised by one of my students that ask me to listen to an Joke about America. Here is how it went: What is the difference between England and the Philippines? nothing. What is the difference between America and the Philippines? The number of whores. I personally did'nt share his enthusiasm of this being funny. So I asked him where he heard this and his friend a Kyoto Univ. had told him of it. Talking about America in decline. The Japanese seem to think so. Will..... ------------------------------ Date: 17 May 91 02:58:55 GMT From: vax5.cit.cornell.edu!usf@cu-arpa.cs.cornell.edu Subject: STUDENT GROUPS USF,INC. UPDATE 8 ************************************************************ * United Space Federation, Inc. posting for May 16th 1991 * ************************************************************ *An International(Multinational) Civil Space Agency by 1993* ************************************************************ HOW TO START A UNITED SPACE FEDERATION STUDENT GROUP 1) YOU MUST FIND 5 OTHER STUDENTS WHO WILL HELP YOU START THE GROUP. 2) YOU MUST FIND A PROFESSOR WHO WILL BE YOUR GROUP ADVISOR. 3) YOU MUST FORWARD THE NAMES OF THE STUDENTS AND YOUR ADVISOR TO THE USF HEADQUARTERS. 4) YOU MUST REGISTER YOUR GROUP ON CAMPUS AND SEND THAT INFORMATION TO USF HEADQUARTERS TO BE VERIFIED. 5) YOUR GROUP MUST PAY A $100 FEE FOR YOUR START UP COSTS FOR YOUR OPERATIONS MANUAL AND OTHER ITEMS YOUR GROUP NEEDS TO BE OFFICIAL. 6) AFTER THE GROUP IS REGISTERED AS A STUDENT GROUP ON YOUR CAMPUS YOU MUST SEND PROF OF Registration TO USF HEADQUARTERS TO BE KEPT ON FILE. 7) WHEN YOUR GROUP HAS BEEN VERIFIED AS A REGISTERED STUDENT GROUP AND HAS PAID THE $100 STARTUP FEE. YOUR OPERATIONS MANUAL WILL BE SENT TO YOU AND YOUR GROUP, WELCOME ABOARD! YOU AND YOUR GROUP AND OTHERS LIKE IT ALL AROUND THE WORLD WILL BE A VERY IMPORTANT PART TO THE SUCCESS OF THE USF. GOODLUCK AND GODSPEED! Rick R. Dobson Executive Director United Space Federation,Inc. Address: UNITED SPACE FEDERATION, INC. International headquarters P.O. Box 4722 Ithaca, New York 14852-4722 In the United States of America ------------------------------ Date: 17 May 91 05:42:34 GMT From: vax5.cit.cornell.edu!usf@cu-arpa.cs.cornell.edu Subject: United Space Federation, Inc. Update 8 ****************************************************** *UNITED SPACE FEDERATION,INC. UPDATE 16th of MAY 1991* ****************************************************** COMMENTS FROM THE FOUNDER WHY IS A WORLD SPACE ORGANIZATION NEEDED ?!? In 1986 I had a very strong dream, or vision if you may!, about the creation of an international civil space agency ( a United Space Federation ). Since 1986 I have pursued my vision with much critixizim and ridicule, But all I have envisioned is coming into being at quite a rapid rate. First, I must state three important insights that give urgency to my efforts : One - Companies, Industries and Economies that where created and supported by the now crumbling era of war economies, are coming apart at the seams. This is creating large amounts of unemployed and HUNGRY! people around the world. A new type of economy is needed to replace this old form; or industrial and technological nations will have no choice but to create new and imaginary threats, to satisfy their hunger and need to expand. What better way to do this than move technology and industry away from the finite resources of earth to the infinite realm of space. There by utilizing this vast new resource, that could create an unlimited potential for new and thriving economies for the world. This would replace or at least offer a viable alternative to the now faltering war economies, with what we might call a peace economy, that all countries could be involved in and benefit from greatly. Space stations, moon bases, missions to mars, bases on mars and an infinite of other possibilities would fill the gap that in the past was dominated by military build ups. If a peace economy through utilization and exploration of this new frontier of space is not realized, the only alternative is a war. Secondly - The growth and affects of technological civilizations is damaging our planets environment. This is threatening our existence along with every other living thing on the planet. Our world is a closed ecological system, so industry and other technological projects cause harm to that closed system because they are inside it. Environmentalist are not going to succeed in stopping this damage to the environment unless they stop the cause, that is humankind reverts to cave dwelling or living under trees. The other alternative and the most logical one ,is to remove many of these afflicting causes out side the closed ecological system of the Earth. This would consist of moving industry and many other damaging environmental technologies, and any future industrial activities, in to space. The first reply by finite earth bound thinkers is to say, why pollute space!! The fact of the matter is earth is a closed ecological system, which is now under great strain by technological civilizations. If you think humankind will give up their curiosity and drive to expand their minds and surroundings and live in caves, this would not only be absurd but a very nieve thought indeed. Earth is finite were as space is infinite, so by moving many these harmful technological projects into space, where they would have little if no impact on its infinite vastness; would to me, seem to be the most practical goal for future expansion and continuation of industrial activities, for which present and future civilizations are, and will be, greatly dependent on for there survival. Thirdly - We as a human existence on this planet are now faced with either adapting or perishing. One of those decisions is that if nations of the world are going to coexist with each other peacefully into the future. There is going to have to be some endeavor which unites the ambitions and desires of these nations for peaceful, constructive and meaningful cooperative activities. I am by no means preaching would peace tomorrow or demiliterization in any way. For as long as humans have emotions and differences, there will be military's and no matter how small or unnoticible they may be there will be wars. I am saying that the bright and ambitious minds of the world need to reach out, if not for reasons of peaceful challenges, it will be for destruction and war. So at present humanity is faced with a decision of great magnitude. This will not and should not be decided by any one government or nation, but as an over all consensus of survival by our world as a whole. It is time for the child of humanity to leave the womb of mother Earth, into the new and vast domain among the stars. For if we stay much longer both mother and child may perish. So in closing it is my hope that a United Space Federation ( an international civil space agency ) may offer a solutions to the present troubles of our world today, by providing a clear and path for humanity far into the future. This is my vision, and my dream is to see it realized within my life time. Thank you for your time and support, Godspeed! Sincerely, Rick R. Dobson Executive Director United Space Federation, Inc. ------------------------------ End of SPACE Digest V13 #581 *******************